Does anyone know if mastodon broadcasts replies to posts?
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@julian wow, ok. That's really helpful - thanks!
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@julian@activitypub.space Replying now because I only saw this thread today (h/t @reiver), but I don't think this is quite accurate as written regarding Mastodon.
AIUI, Mastodon decouples replying and notifying. If you reply to a post from a Mastodon server but do not tag the author of the parent post, they will be part of the ActivityPub recipient list (and their server will receive the reply), but if the parent poster is also on a Mastodon server, they will not receive a notification about the reply.
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@julian@activitypub.space Replying now because I only saw this thread today (h/t @reiver), but I don't think this is quite accurate as written regarding Mastodon.
AIUI, Mastodon decouples replying and notifying. If you reply to a post from a Mastodon server but do not tag the author of the parent post, they will be part of the ActivityPub recipient list (and their server will receive the reply), but if the parent poster is also on a Mastodon server, they will not receive a notification about the reply.
In other words, @paulgc, you should be seeing those Create activities if the reply comes from Mastodon. I think if you reply to a post on your server from https://activitypub.academy you can inspect the payload that gets sent.
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In other words, @paulgc, you should be seeing those Create activities if the reply comes from Mastodon. I think if you reply to a post on your server from https://activitypub.academy you can inspect the payload that gets sent.
@julian@fietkau.social @julian@activitypub.space @reiver Thanks - you're right, I am now seeing them. They turned up at the shared inbox, rather than the user's inbox, which is why I was missing them to start with. activitypub.academy looks useful!
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@julian@fietkau.social @julian@activitypub.space @reiver Thanks - you're right, I am now seeing them. They turned up at the shared inbox, rather than the user's inbox, which is why I was missing them to start with. activitypub.academy looks useful!
@paulgc@mastodon.social yes, shared inbox is useful to reduce the number of requests sent.
NodeBB will always use a shared inbox if one can be found for the user.
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@julian@fietkau.social @julian@activitypub.space @reiver Thanks - you're right, I am now seeing them. They turned up at the shared inbox, rather than the user's inbox, which is why I was missing them to start with. activitypub.academy looks useful!
@paulgc Glad it's working! Although now that I've tested it myself, I'm not quite as confident anymore. 🤔 A test reply I made at https://activitypub.academy/@begusla_laddaciul/115865414668779913 has the ActivityPub `to` set as the account's followers and `cc` to as.Public, but was sent to my server anyway. So I guess the behavior, at least on activitypub.academy, is to not individually address the parent poster, but send them a copy of the post anyway (presumably justified by W3C ActivityPub §7.1.3). Feels a bit funky.
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@paulgc Glad it's working! Although now that I've tested it myself, I'm not quite as confident anymore. 🤔 A test reply I made at https://activitypub.academy/@begusla_laddaciul/115865414668779913 has the ActivityPub `to` set as the account's followers and `cc` to as.Public, but was sent to my server anyway. So I guess the behavior, at least on activitypub.academy, is to not individually address the parent poster, but send them a copy of the post anyway (presumably justified by W3C ActivityPub §7.1.3). Feels a bit funky.
@julian@fietkau.social @paulgc@mastodon.social mm, I don't suppose there's any reason addressees and delivery recipients need align.
You can't enforce it 😁
NodeBB does this too, where we'll send a copy of a reply to everybody in the immediate chain, even if they're not mentioned.
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@julian@activitypub.space @paulgc I'm lucky none of my projects so far have needed to really deal with replies, so I haven't had to think about this. 😄
But it reminds me how I've been told that Misskey sends an account's likes to its followers in addition to the author of the liked post, which Mastodon does not. So on Misskey, if a post comes by your feed that someone you follow has previously liked, you see that information. That's cool in some ways and showcases implementation differences in activity delivery.
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@julian@activitypub.space @paulgc I'm lucky none of my projects so far have needed to really deal with replies, so I haven't had to think about this. 😄
But it reminds me how I've been told that Misskey sends an account's likes to its followers in addition to the author of the liked post, which Mastodon does not. So on Misskey, if a post comes by your feed that someone you follow has previously liked, you see that information. That's cool in some ways and showcases implementation differences in activity delivery.
@julian@fietkau.social that's a great idea! I should adopt that, there's no downside.
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@julian@activitypub.space @julian@fietkau.social well, in theory, you can have private likes and public likes. misskey and pleroma do public likes. mastodon does private likes, but then shows them publicly if anyone asks the origin site. because addressing is just a suggestion, apparently ;)
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@julian If forwarded activity doesn't have a signature (FEP-8b32 or LD signature), you can fetch it by its ID. Mitra does this. Not all activity IDs are dereferenceable (hello Mastodon), but some are :)
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If I post something to a remote community, Mastodon people reply directly to me, and it doesn't make it to the remote community. 👎
If I snuck in a mention to the community (but not in text), Mastodon would prefill the community mention and it would propagate correctly. 👍
Tell me this is a bad idea.......
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@julian@activitypub.space @julian@fietkau.social well, in theory, you can have private likes and public likes. misskey and pleroma do public likes. mastodon does private likes, but then shows them publicly if anyone asks the origin site. because addressing is just a suggestion, apparently ;)
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@trwnh@mastodon.social I thought inbox forwarding between instances was a non-starter per the AP spec because you cannot guarantee that the activity hasn't been tampered with.
I thought it must be paired with a signature of some sort.
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> group itself be the distributor
well, naturally, i would suggest addressing both the group and its members. just like you would address both a person and their followers. or a moderated conversation and its audience. the way inbox forwarding works is that someone has to do the forwarding from their inbox. :)
> list is hidden
you don't need to know the items. that's private info, and you just need the id to be understood by the forwarder (who will themselves know the secret items)
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@evan The groups (private groups, specifically) aspect is the reason why I brought up this topic at all — it was mostly for my understanding of the spec because to my knowledge, there weren't many collections being passed around in recipient fields; the only one being /follower, which isn't always resolvable.
The same issues would occur around private groups... a public group publishing something a /members collection would be addressable, but not a private group or one whose membership list is hidden.
All threadiverse softwares work around this by having the group itself be the distributor, and so you needn't address a members collection, you just need to ensure the group itself is addressed. The rest is implied (which HA! I bet @trwnh@mastodon.social has much to say about implied behaviour)
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@silverpill @technical-discussion it's part of the outbox delivery algorithm, which bridges between c2s and s2s. the intention is that the outbox publishes activities via c2s, but then optionally delivers based on addressing properties via s2s
(this ends up having other issues in practice due to the lack of an envelope, but at least the intent of "relevant activities should trigger notifications for relevant entities" makes sense, per 6.1 clients "look at" some relevant props)
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@silverpill @julian @technical-discussion
example: alice and bob on site.example each have followers collections, but alice can't see bob's followers. if alice addresses bob's followers collection, then alice's outbox can't deliver to bob's followers. alice must address bob, and bob can choose to forward to bob's followers (inbox forwarding)
if site.example has a collection of "local users" that alice can see, then alice can address it and alice's outbox can deliver to items
