*clicks onto linkedin*

[faoluin@chitter.xyz]

@ariadne I'd take Ex Machina over this timeline. The robot wins and the techbros get their comeuppance.

[ska@social.treehouse.systems]

@ariadne look, I'm all for giving these guys AI sexbots if it makes them leave real women alone

[ariadne@social.treehouse.systems]

@ska on one hand, valid, but on the other, it tells us what they really want out of these things

[ska@social.treehouse.systems]

@ariadne Ex Machina was a good movie, the only unrealistic thing was that the techbro was the cautious one and didn't get bamboozled by his creation.

[dalias@hachyderm.io]

@ska @ariadne Narrator: It didn't make them leave real women alone.

It just let them normalize the feel of having that kind of power relationship.

The same way letting them have "AI slaves" won't make them want to bring back human slavery any less, but rather more.

It just whets their appetite.

[equinox@chaos.social]

@ariadne @ska I'd be perfectly happy if they only wanted that out of these *things*. Like, let them have at it. Unfortunately I'm afraid it also tells us what they want out of *people*. And humanizing those pieces of software also dehumanizes actual people.

[dr2chase@ohai.social]

@ariadne "does that movie have a 'happy ending'?"

[ska@social.treehouse.systems]

@dalias @ariadne Sure. But you could say the same thing about porn, which I see as a net positive for society, because imagine guys without that outlet.

I think that guys who want that kind of power will want it anyway, and letting them have some sort of substitute minimizes harm. I may be wrong about this. I'm not recommending we set up scientific trials to study what the net result is.

[ska@social.treehouse.systems]

@equinox @ariadne They are already dehumanizing people, they didn't wait for AI chatbots.

It's hard to tell how to reduce harm. Apart from evicting these guys out of any position of power forever, obviously.

[dalias@hachyderm.io]

@ska @ariadne I mean for certain types of "porn" (particularly, CSAM, but maybe some other things too?) I think it does make things worse not serve as an "outlet" or "harm minimization". Probably this has something to do with whether the production itself involves the awful power dynamic they crave, vs legitimate porn where production is consensual.

[lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me]

@dalias @ska @ariadne Also I think there's a bit about (re)presentation, like if in-story sex crimes makes audience/characters afraid of consequences or actually jailed is different from the various kinds of horrors some probably want.

[ska@social.treehouse.systems]

@dalias @ariadne Yeah I thought it was obvious that the issue with CSAM is production, and its consumption is bad because it's an incentive to produce more.

I don't know how I really feel about AI-generated CSAM, if that's a thing (who are we kidding, of course that's a thing). Disgusted, certainly, but I kinda see it as "sick" more than "evil", if that makes sense.

[outfrost@mastodon.social]

@ska @dalias watching porn of consenting adults, and having a virtual sex slave, less than half one's age, incapable of consent or saying "no", are dramatically different things

[dalias@hachyderm.io]

@outfrost @ska Yeah that's basically my point.