Firefox uses on-device downloaded-on-demand ML models for privacy-preserving translation.

[mdavis@mastodon.social]

@mcc @firefoxwebdevs I would mostly agree with this if you added this at the end of your statement: …by an idiot programmer or one who didn’t grow up and learn to code properly during the decades before AI LLMs.

In reality, I don’t think either of us are going to get our way on this one.

[mycelialinn@mastodon.social]

@firefoxwebdevs

I would say every feature in everything should be a separate toggle to the best of its ability.

Also, by "open data", I hope you mean "the data's license gives consent to be used in this way", not "the data exists on the web somewhere".

[lanodan@queer.hacktivis.me]

@dalias @firefoxwebdevs Which is also kind of funny when compared to pro-privacy features like containers being put as extensions.

[fnordinger@mastodon.social]

@jaffathecake This article claims that LLMs are always transformers. This is not true, in fact the first LLMs were LSTMs (https://arxiv.org/abs/2405.04517).

[davidgerard@circumstances.run]

@knowler @firefoxwebdevs it absolutely was not! he means "open data" as in "we found it lying around, bugger the license" https://mas.to/@twifkak/115849848003348176

[davidgerard@circumstances.run]

@tanfonto @firefoxwebdevs "stolen" https://mas.to/@twifkak/115849848003348176

[davidgerard@circumstances.run]

@wes @firefoxwebdevs @liquor_american so do I, but also it should be an extension

[drjosh9000@cloudisland.nz]

@firefoxwebdevs what about an "AI enable" switch that is off by default

that would be cool

[mcc@mastodon.social]

@mdavis @firefoxwebdevs I don't like the word "idiot". But a programmer who would use LLM codegen is a programmer with bad judgement. A programmer who has bad judgement cannot spot the errors made by LLM codegen. QED.

Anyway I already got what I wanted: Servo, the web browser which will replace Firefox, has *already* banned "AI" code contributions. So it's only a matter of time before Servo is complete enough for day to day use, and I can delete the AI-infected Firefox from my computer.

[fmasy@piaille.fr]

@Rycochet @firefoxwebdevs @zzt I did not follow all what happened around Firefox and the community. Did Mozilla made a public consultation regarding AI integration in Firefox ?
Do we have some reliable datas about the opinion of the Firefox's users ?

I would be interested to know if the critical views (that I mostly share) expressed here are largely shared or not.

[yoasif@mastodon.social]

@fmasy @Rycochet @firefoxwebdevs @zzt You can look at the discussions on Mozilla Connect if you want commentary from community members.

Mozilla does occasionally run surveys, but results are never public.

[firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social]

@yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @zzt the results of this poll are visible as soon as you vote. They'll be visible to all once the poll ends.

[davidgerard@circumstances.run]

@firefoxwebdevs @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @zzt a self-selecting survey with push-poll questions that deliberately leave out the "no LLMs in Firefox" option is unlikely to be statistically valid

(also we know this is just noise and Mozilla will do whatever was planned in the meeting anyway)

[firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social]

@davidgerard @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @zzt I realise your position is immutable, but I've already used the results of this survey to push for a change to the design of the kill switch. I'm grateful to everyone who responded.

[zzt@mas.to]

@firefoxwebdevs @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet is the change to the design of the kill switch that it doesn’t exist because all of Firefox’s AI features will be moved into add-ons that aren’t installed by default?

if not, you’ve used the results of the poll to misrepresent community opinion and @davidgerard’s quote unquote “immutable position”, whatever that means to people who don’t speak passive aggressive post-it note, is absolutely correct

[firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social]

@zzt @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @davidgerard My interpretation of the poll results is that the vast majority of people feel that the translation engine should be disabled as part of an AI kill switch, but there should be a way to re-enable the translation engine whilst leaving the kill switch otherwise active.

[angelfeast@blorbo.social]

@firefoxwebdevs @zzt @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @davidgerard the poll was misleading and i am sure i am not the only one who voted to re-enable the translation because it wasn't fully clear what that meant. if i could revoke my vote i would.

[firefoxwebdevs@mastodon.social]

@angelfeast @zzt @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @davidgerard as in, you don't think there should be an option to re-enable it, or that it should be enabled by default?

[nuintari@mastodon.bsd.cafe]

@firefoxwebdevs @angelfeast @zzt @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @davidgerard

Missing option, if shouldn't be in the browser code in the first place. It should be an add-on that the user has to explicitly install.

A suspect lot of people voted for the, "but allow it to re-enabled," option due to it being the least shitty choice presented. Not because that is the behavior they actually desire.

[heptapodenthusiast@mathstodon.xyz]

@nuintari @firefoxwebdevs @angelfeast @zzt @yoasif @fmasy @Rycochet @davidgerard THIS. Anyone who's ever written a poll or survey that's not *deliberately* a push poll knows that polls influence the beliefs of the people being polled, by choosing which options are presented vs hidden and by the exact wording of the question and options. It simply cannot be avoided, only minimized.