For all the Proton fans

[wakinuniversejo@rivals.space]

@serebit
What's your alternative ?
Asking for a friend...
@skinnylatte

[skua@mastodon.social]

@skinnylatte

I've not seen such responses for a long time.

For your next posts you could criticise Microsoft, Musk & Linus Torvalds.

We could make a new "popularity index" this way.

[jeffcodes@infosec.exchange]

@lucas @skinnylatte
Additionally, privacy and encryption != free from consequences of illegal activity.

Proton is also zero-knowledge with email and drive, meaning contents is encrypted behind anyone’s purview without the password.

Swiss law requires a retention period of 10 years for financial data. I would have to imagine some of this information might fall under that umbrella.

[serebit@floss.social]

@WakinUniverseJo @skinnylatte I switched to https://forwardemail.net. It doesn't currently have a web UI, so I use Thunderbird with it.

[pyrogenesis@mefi.social]

@r3dr3clus3 @skinnylatte If you don't have the data, you can be ordered to give it up by whomever, and you can't. Proton mail claims privacy, but it in fact saves enough data to identify a single individual.

The headline is not biased. Proton claims things they actually can't uphold. This is not the fault of the customer. Stop blaming the victim.

[taylor@social.axfive.net]

@skinnylatte

We want to first clarify that Proton did not provide any information to the FBI, the information was obtained from the Swiss justice department via MLAT. Proton only provides the limited information that we have when issued with a legally binding order from Swiss authorities, which can only happen after all Swiss legal checks are passed. This is an important distinction because Proton operates exclusively under Swiss law

I don't use Proton products at all (not for any idealist reasons), but I don't really think this can be much of a condemnation of the company. I don't know what else you can expect them to do in this case.

edit: That said, the real takeaway is that if you want to remain anonymous to a service that can be compelled to hand over data about you (read: more or less any service you might want to use), you should not pay with a credit card linked to your actual name, you should not access it from your home IP address, and you should not use it in any way that links it to your real self.

Proton is security focused, but even they are bound by the laws of the country they operate in.  Use TOR, use E2EE, pay with cryptocurrency, maintain hermetic separation between your anonymous and public selves, etc.

[rickscully@heads.social]

@skinnylatte @serebit their embrace of crypto is what made me leave.

[taylor@social.axfive.net]

@freediverx @boojum @skinnylatte That they will protect your privacy to the limit that they legally can, perhaps? A privacy-focused email provider that doesn't abide by the laws of the country they operate in stops existing pretty quickly.

[oneloop@mastodon.xyz]

@skinnylatte I know someone who will have a field day with this story @Tutanota

[wakinuniversejo@rivals.space]

@serebit @skinnylatte thanks a bunch

[lil5@social.linux.pizza]

@rickscully @skinnylatte @serebit

Ironic, had proton accepted Monero, compliance wouldn’t have been possible.

[tealincubusspeckles@mastodon.social]

@skinnylatte So I've seen someone say an alternative is forwardemail.net paired with Thunderbird as an alert native to Proton. Are there any other mailing services?

[crazyeddie@mastodon.social]

@taylor @skinnylatte Really surprised that 404 would give it such a hyped headline if that's all it's about.

I don't think even proton's vpn service claims that they can't be compelled to give over the payment details and account information of your VPN account.

This isn't information they've claimed they will or can secure against being compelled like this.

[jeffcodes@infosec.exchange]

@Pyrogenesis @r3dr3clus3 @skinnylatte
Privacy does not mean you can’t be identified. That’s anonymity. Privacy means your content is for you and the intended recipients only.
Proton does not advertise anonymity. There is a difference, and that’s important to know as a consumer.

[k3ym0@infosec.exchange]

@serebit @skinnylatte what got him was paying for his “anonymous” account with his Platinum Visa like a normie buying socks on Amazon.

Proton handed over the payment identifier, Swiss authorities passed it to the FBI, and suddenly your anonymity has a name on it.

if you’re not paying with Monero or cash, you don’t have an anonymous email. you have encrypted email with a billing address. those are very different things.

[drangnon@hachyderm.io]

@skinnylatte displeased as I am about this event, I will contend that you aren't an anonymous anything if you use your US credit card to pay for a service directly. all the banks have anti-"terrorist" KYC going on and if the credit card is associated to a US bank, there it is.

[xferok@tacobelllabs.net]

@skinnylatte love that all the replies are circlejerking defending proton like their product doesn’t kind of suck to use, cost too much and not actually have many real security benefits.

Not to mention the weird swiss technolibertarianism of their CEO.

[freediverx@mastodon.social]

@taylor @boojum @skinnylatte

If they can't structure their service in a way that avoids the collection and storage of personally identifiable customer data, then they have no business claiming they offer privacy. This is like charging a premium for the world’s most secure door lock when a burglar can easily enter your house by breaking a window.

[xferok@tacobelllabs.net]

@skinnylatte Fastmail is right there for less money with better features, and they don’t lie to you about how they’ve made a relatively insecure protocol more secure!

[cthw@mstdn.ca]

@skinnylatte

Without following their countries laws …?