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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
Unfortunately, this fails in both #physics and #theology.
The physics failure is in skipping part of the full energy–momentum relation. Energy does not imply mass. It implies mass or momentum. Photons have energy, but they do not have mass, for example.
The theology failure is that the Christian conception of God (the Father) is external to spacetime, i.e. transcendent. There's no metric tensor to apply. There's no general relativistic description for the relationship between God and the physical universe. General relativistic concepts like black holes do not apply.
Then you have the issue of God (the Son) as intercessor to deal with. Sins don't get sent straight to God the Father.
Good try. No cigar, though.
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@Colman @bassthang @cstross @mxchara I suspect that particular problem space has been thoroughly mapped. (See also Suzy Izzard on original sin: "Heard it!")
@geeksam I'm assuming inserting(*) NEW weird sex acts into the graph of existing weird sex acts is at most N log N, or even less if there's a hashed index or caching?
(* - heh heh heh.)
@Colman @bassthang @cstross @mxchara -
@HighlandLawyer @cstross @mxchara
Until the intent to sin is fully formed the quantum state of the sin has yet to resolve. If the intent/repent threshold resolves to repentance is that an anti-sin? -
From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross to be judged at all, sin or not, requires information to be available to god/jesus, so you can just existencmaxx.
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross that sounds like the theory behind Shabtai Zvi's attempt at immanentizing the eschaton.
(Wikipedia calls him Sabbatai Zevi.)
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
Praise be that Lucifer didn't figure out that trick by 0 AD, otherwise we'd be living in a nice little black hole -
Unfortunately, this fails in both #physics and #theology.
The physics failure is in skipping part of the full energy–momentum relation. Energy does not imply mass. It implies mass or momentum. Photons have energy, but they do not have mass, for example.
The theology failure is that the Christian conception of God (the Father) is external to spacetime, i.e. transcendent. There's no metric tensor to apply. There's no general relativistic description for the relationship between God and the physical universe. General relativistic concepts like black holes do not apply.
Then you have the issue of God (the Son) as intercessor to deal with. Sins don't get sent straight to God the Father.
Good try. No cigar, though.
@JdeBP @cstross - (I'm going to regret this)
"Energy does not imply mass."
Thoroughly incorrect. They are literally the same thing.
"Photons have energy, but they do not have mass, for example."
Incorrect.
Photons have a _rest mass_ of zero; their mass consists entirely of the kinetic energy term. A photon has a mass of (h * frequency) / c^2.
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@JdeBP @cstross - (I'm going to regret this)
"Energy does not imply mass."
Thoroughly incorrect. They are literally the same thing.
"Photons have energy, but they do not have mass, for example."
Incorrect.
Photons have a _rest mass_ of zero; their mass consists entirely of the kinetic energy term. A photon has a mass of (h * frequency) / c^2.
You are likely going to regret that. (-:
When discussing the energy–momentum relation, mass *is* by convention rest mass, as the usual formulation E^2=m^2×c^4+(p×c)^2 is in terms of rest mass m.
The relation says that energy does not imply mass when m=0. Energy implies the momentum portion of the sum, which photons have, defined as p=h/λ.
With m=0 the full form reduces to E^2=(p×c)^2 which after substitution for photon momentum becomes E=c×h/λ=h×f .
But this does not become a statement about mass. It's fallacious to then substitute E=m×c^2 and solve for m to get m=h×f/c^2 .
E=m×c^2 is a different reduced case for massive stationary objects (m>0, p=0), neither of which is the case for photons. Furthermore, the maths yields divergent γ=∞ Taylor series sums when u=c so thinking of K.E. terms for photons is aphysical.
Energy-mass equivalence is a special form for the case of m>0, γ≠∞. Energy does not imply mass in the general case.
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross Though the Kabbalists say that God exists outside of the universe, having withdrawn a portion of itself (tzimtzum), creating a void for the universe to expand into.
Or something. -
@bassthang @mxchara But nobody has just ONE sin! Everybody has one OR MORE sins. So you actually need a vector to encode their sin, one that can accommodate both the nature of the sins and their severity separately. To compare sinfulness of the undeserving one then needs to consider homogeneous matrix transformations …
@cstross @bassthang @mxchara Being “judged” …
Since when has severity been relevant, biblical commandments look pretty binary to me, and most folks fall foul of one of them, so you can just do an OR on that and return one bit per person?
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@cstross anyway I wouldn't worry about attacking Heaven if I were you, Charlie. God's already dead. Surely you've already been informed...
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross But... but what if that already happened? .oO( Nietsches first entropy Lemma? 😂😂)
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@cstross A Distributed Denial of Salvation attack?
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross
Most sins don't carry a lot of information.The sins of humanity are banal, and therefore highly compressible.
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross
#sinMaxxing … I think that’s what’s right now Bein done by the #EpsteinClass (I wanted to use that) right no.
They have the motivation another means to do it. -
@NuclearOatmeal @cstross Let's assume God operates at 37 °C, since He made man in His image, roughly 310 K, Since God is a perfect being, I'm assuming He's operating close to the Landauer principle limit, so one bit of leads to a divine energy change of something like 2.97e-21 J/bit. Using E = mc² we get that 16.5 solar masses gives an energy target of 1.79e+47 J, so we need roughly (1.79e+47 J) / (2.97e-21 J/bit) ~= 6.03e67 bits of sin to make Him collapse into Himself.
How to sin at that scale in sufficiently short time is left as an exercise to the reader.
@Lemmus @NuclearOatmeal @cstross So we need to form a Kinky Galactic Empire to kill God?
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From bluesky:
Posit that to be judged for a sin implies that information about the sin is available to god/jesus.
Information implies entropy implies energy implies mass.
...so you can run an attack on heaven by sinmaxxing so hard Christ converts into a black hole from sheer acquired mass-energy and oneshots God by trapping him in something not even His light can escape from
@cstross So does that mean Sodom and Gomorrah were hit by the OOM killer?
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@henstridge No, because at 16.5M☉ the black hole is massive enough there's going to be very little Hawking Radiation, at least for the first 10^62 or so years.
Fun that you talk about Hawking radiation, considering that he was apparently doing some practical experimentation on sinmaxxing (by getting invited to Epstein's island... hmm...)
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