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Context removal from an audience

Technical Discussion
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  • This is an extension of the discussion from Topic removal from a category/community.

    In it, rimu@piefed.social shared the Lemmy federation primer which details that Delete(Object) is federated whenever a post is removed from a community.

    I needed a way to communicate when a topic/context (not the top-level post) is removed from a category/audience, but is not deleted. You might ask — how is removing a context different from deleting it? In this case, a removed context still exists and is still resolvable. A context can removed from an audience in NodeBB.

    Note that Lemmy and Piefed don't have a concept of an audience-less context, so if a context is removed from an audience, it would simply be deleted. No additional logic required.

    Anyhow — when a topic is moved into Uncategorized (which is a catch-all bucket for... you guessed it, uncategorized content), NodeBB will federate a Remove. It looks something like this:

    {
    	id: '#activity/remove/',
    	type: 'Remove',
    	actor: '',
    	to: [],
    	cc: [,
    	object: '',
    	origin: '',
    }
    

    This is live on activitypub.space already.

    This goes hand-in-hand with topic moving, which would follow similar mechanisms, except it'd be a Move instead of a Remove.

    I will likely write an FEP with technical details for both Remove and Move, and will include existing behaviours (Delete(Object)) as well.

  • nodebb@fosstodon.orgundefined nodebb@fosstodon.org shared this topic on

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  • @julian i'd say the confusion is primarily that we've shifted topic around several different things and i'm still not sure which is the intended topic of the discussion :x

    - deleting posts that are in a thread
    - removing posts from a thread
    - implications for downstream posts in a thread when some ancestor in the reply chain is deleted/removed
    - deleting a thread that is in a forum
    - removing a thread from a forum
    - moving a thread to the "uncategorized" forum
    - ...?

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  • @julian if the intent is to signal what happens when nodebb moves a thread to "uncategorized", then i think the simplest thing is for nodebb to treat "uncategorized" as a forum in itself, still. you already assign them an id of -1, so you are in effect treating the "uncategorized" category as a category still.

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  • @julian the confusing thing to me, though, is that both Delete and Remove already don't imply anything about posts in the thread if the thread is deleted/removed from the forum.

    by default, if you Delete a thread, the forum might still have a broken link to the now-deleted thread, and the posts also have broken links to the thread.

    by default, if you Remove a thread from the forum, the posts still exist within the thread.

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  • trwnh@mastodon.social specifically however, is that you're not deleting the context. Just removing it.

    NodeBB has the concept of a context not belonging to an audience (the "uncategorized" pseudo category.) in those specific situations, contexts would be removed from the audience, not deleted.

    Lemmy and Piefed don't have these concepts, so they simply delete them. So therein lies some of the confusion I believe.

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  • @julian like removing a whole thread from the forum? Remove(object=thread, target=forum)? this seems like something altogether different than removing posts from a thread.

    removing threads from a forum is possible but if the thread is owned by the forum then the forum can also delete them.

    the part that differs between impls is whether Delete(thing that is a context) should do anything to objects where context = the Delete.object, right? i think it makes the most sense to just orphan them.

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  • trwnh@mastodon.social it signals that the actor is removing the context from the targeted audience.

    The audience can optionally announce it, and receivers synchronizing with that audience (per 1b12) should follow suit and remove the context as well.

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  • @julian what does Remove(Context) mean here?

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  • trwnh@mastodon.social said in Deleting a post vs deleting an entire comment tree:
    > Remove(object=[n posts],target=thread)

    That would indeed be the most explicit, but that isn't needed from threadiverse because that information is already contained when you set object to the context itself.

    It's even resolvable! So there's no need to send your own array of items that might be out of date by the time it is delivered.

    Hence why I advocate for Remove(Context)

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