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  4. 🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

Pianificato Fissato Bloccato Spostato Senza categoria
webkeydirectorywkdemailencryptionprivacyinfoseccryptographyopenpgp
33 Post 9 Autori 0 Visualizzazioni
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  • Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
    Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
    Nicola Fabiano
    scritto ultima modifica di
    #1

    🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

    Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

    WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

    https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

    #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

    Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined chimbosonicundefined Pierricundefined Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)undefined michaundefined 6 Risposte Ultima Risposta
    • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

      🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

      Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

      WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

      https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

      #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

      Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
      Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
      Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️
      scritto ultima modifica di
      #2

      @nicfab

      @yunohost
      @nextcloud (Mail)
      @freedomboxfndn

      Are / will you support this option for encrypted email? (^^^ Previous toot)

      #Encryption #Email #WKD #Privacy #Yunohost #Nextcloud #Freedombox #WebKeyDirectory #Cryptography #OpenPGP

      Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
      • Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️

        @nicfab

        @yunohost
        @nextcloud (Mail)
        @freedomboxfndn

        Are / will you support this option for encrypted email? (^^^ Previous toot)

        #Encryption #Email #WKD #Privacy #Yunohost #Nextcloud #Freedombox #WebKeyDirectory #Cryptography #OpenPGP

        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
        Nicola Fabiano
        scritto ultima modifica di
        #3

        @Blort @yunohost @nextcloud @freedomboxfndn
        Yes, of course! Why not?
        I have my WKD

        Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
        • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

          @Blort @yunohost @nextcloud @freedomboxfndn
          Yes, of course! Why not?
          I have my WKD

          Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
          Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
          Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️
          scritto ultima modifica di
          #4

          @nicfab

          FYI That question was primarily aimed at Yunohost / Nextcloud / Freedombox, as I'd love to know if the tools I already use, make this user friendly to setup yet. ;)

          Either way, this looks fascinating! While I lack the technical expertise to validate the approach, the promise is extremely appealing, raising the possibility that the most popular, #FOSS social network on the planet (email) could finally be made encrypted for the masses (such as I), doing for email what Let's Encrypt did for web servers.

          Coming more from a marketing background myself, my first thought was what it would take to get widespread adoption, which seems to be support from major (FOSS + commercial) email server applications. From a quick skim of your article, it seems adding support shouldn't be onerous...

          Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
          • Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️

            @nicfab

            FYI That question was primarily aimed at Yunohost / Nextcloud / Freedombox, as I'd love to know if the tools I already use, make this user friendly to setup yet. ;)

            Either way, this looks fascinating! While I lack the technical expertise to validate the approach, the promise is extremely appealing, raising the possibility that the most popular, #FOSS social network on the planet (email) could finally be made encrypted for the masses (such as I), doing for email what Let's Encrypt did for web servers.

            Coming more from a marketing background myself, my first thought was what it would take to get widespread adoption, which seems to be support from major (FOSS + commercial) email server applications. From a quick skim of your article, it seems adding support shouldn't be onerous...

            Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
            Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
            Nicola Fabiano
            scritto ultima modifica di
            #5

            @Blort
            Sorry for the misunderstanding.
            I strongly believe that everyone should communicate exclusively via encrypted email, and I have held this position for many years.
            I published several posts on my blog on that topic.

            Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
            • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

              🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

              Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

              WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

              https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

              #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

              chimbosonicundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
              chimbosonicundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
              chimbosonic
              scritto ultima modifica di
              #6

              @nicfab seeing https://wkd.dp42.dev referenced has made my day!

              Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
              • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                @Blort
                Sorry for the misunderstanding.
                I strongly believe that everyone should communicate exclusively via encrypted email, and I have held this position for many years.
                I published several posts on my blog on that topic.

                Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️
                scritto ultima modifica di
                #7

                @nicfab I take full credit / blame for any misunderstanding there! I forgot Masto would automatically @ you in any reply, and didn't think about how it would look like I was directing the question at you. My bad!

                I'd love to see a wider discussion of this though, as the ramifications could be groundbreaking to private communications.

                If there's one thing my professional life has taught me, it's how making things even a tiny bit easier / harder can have huge ramifications on what people actually do (or not).

                This seems like it could genuinely make encrypted email easy after decades of adoption being very hard. That gets me very interested in the strengths and limitations of the approach and how it's adoption could be encouraged.

                Could it be extended to something like @delta chat?

                Delta Chatundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                • chimbosonicundefined chimbosonic

                  @nicfab seeing https://wkd.dp42.dev referenced has made my day!

                  Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                  Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                  Nicola Fabiano
                  scritto ultima modifica di nicfab@fosstodon.org
                  #8

                  @chimbosonic I mentioned your tool in my article. Read it! 😀
                  Congratulations on your work! Great resource!

                  1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                  • Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️undefined Blort™ 🐀Ⓥ🥋☣️

                    @nicfab I take full credit / blame for any misunderstanding there! I forgot Masto would automatically @ you in any reply, and didn't think about how it would look like I was directing the question at you. My bad!

                    I'd love to see a wider discussion of this though, as the ramifications could be groundbreaking to private communications.

                    If there's one thing my professional life has taught me, it's how making things even a tiny bit easier / harder can have huge ramifications on what people actually do (or not).

                    This seems like it could genuinely make encrypted email easy after decades of adoption being very hard. That gets me very interested in the strengths and limitations of the approach and how it's adoption could be encouraged.

                    Could it be extended to something like @delta chat?

                    Delta Chatundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                    Delta Chatundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                    Delta Chat
                    scritto ultima modifica di
                    #9

                    @Blort @nicfab we know about wkd and some of us have engaged with it in earlier times. Our current trajectory of #chatmail developments is not directly fitting as we are aiming to hide all cryptographic identity information from the transport layer (email servers). Wkd rather reinforces the central role of email servers in managing and controlling a users cryptographic identity. Besides there are error cases (wkd down/erroring), stale keys and other issues that cause UX challenges.

                    Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                    • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                      🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

                      Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

                      WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

                      https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

                      #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

                      Pierricundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                      Pierricundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                      Pierric
                      scritto ultima modifica di
                      #10

                      @nicfab I did not know of this, and find it fascinating. I use proton with a custom domain, so I don't benefit from it based on the article. Next project: setting up my wkd server!

                      Only downside: I make extensive use of catch-all addresses, and I suppose wkd doesn't account for a "default user inbox" if it relies on username hashes like the article explains. But still worth setting up!

                      Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                      • Delta Chatundefined Delta Chat

                        @Blort @nicfab we know about wkd and some of us have engaged with it in earlier times. Our current trajectory of #chatmail developments is not directly fitting as we are aiming to hide all cryptographic identity information from the transport layer (email servers). Wkd rather reinforces the central role of email servers in managing and controlling a users cryptographic identity. Besides there are error cases (wkd down/erroring), stale keys and other issues that cause UX challenges.

                        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                        Nicola Fabiano
                        scritto ultima modifica di
                        #11

                        @delta @Blort I won't go into technical details here. There is an IETF draft that I referred to. I appreciate your work, but standards must be respected. If any WKDs are not working, there may be misconfiguration issues.

                        Delta Chatundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                        • Pierricundefined Pierric

                          @nicfab I did not know of this, and find it fascinating. I use proton with a custom domain, so I don't benefit from it based on the article. Next project: setting up my wkd server!

                          Only downside: I make extensive use of catch-all addresses, and I suppose wkd doesn't account for a "default user inbox" if it relies on username hashes like the article explains. But still worth setting up!

                          Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                          Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                          Nicola Fabiano
                          scritto ultima modifica di
                          #12

                          @PierricD You can set up WKD with your domain name even if the MX records are on Proton. You need a server.

                          tudobemundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                          • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                            @delta @Blort I won't go into technical details here. There is an IETF draft that I referred to. I appreciate your work, but standards must be respected. If any WKDs are not working, there may be misconfiguration issues.

                            Delta Chatundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                            Delta Chatundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                            Delta Chat
                            scritto ultima modifica di
                            #13

                            @nicfab @Blort we know there is an IETF doc about wkd. Delta is probably one of the most standards based messengers out there https://github.com/chatmail/core/blob/main/standards.md
                            But that doesn't mean any IETF standard is unconditionally a good idea for resilient decentralized messaging.

                            Nicola Fabianoundefined 3 Risposte Ultima Risposta
                            • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                              @PierricD You can set up WKD with your domain name even if the MX records are on Proton. You need a server.

                              tudobemundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                              tudobemundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                              tudobem
                              scritto ultima modifica di
                              #14

                              @nicfab @PierricD what would the average annual server cost be if one were to set up a server simply for WKD? I‘m not a tech guy unfortunately, so I find it difficult to assess

                              Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                              • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                                🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

                                Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

                                WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

                                https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

                                #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

                                Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)undefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)
                                scritto ultima modifica di
                                #15

                                @nicfab I appreciate every attempt to make the web more secure by default.

                                What is your opinion on if I would state: Isn’t encrypted mail also stored forever and readable in the future? As e-mail lacks PFS…

                                I’m more concerned about that and things like headers being not encrypted and therefore, leaking meta data, than getting my keys to ppl.

                                If things must change it is probably SMTP that needs a successor with things like double ratchet session keys and key exchange parameters. And while we’re on it, probably some post quantum ability would fit the timeline we are in.

                                What do you think?

                                Nicola Fabianoundefined 6 Risposte Ultima Risposta
                                • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                                  🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

                                  Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

                                  WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

                                  https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

                                  #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

                                  michaundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                  michaundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                  micha
                                  scritto ultima modifica di
                                  #16

                                  @nicfab @koehntopp Sounds too good. Hope it's not. 😃👍

                                  Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                                  • michaundefined micha

                                    @nicfab @koehntopp Sounds too good. Hope it's not. 😃👍

                                    Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                    Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                    Nicola Fabiano
                                    scritto ultima modifica di
                                    #17

                                    @micha @koehntopp Why not?

                                    1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                                    • Nicola Fabianoundefined Nicola Fabiano

                                      🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

                                      Web Key Directory (WKD) changes this: automatic encryption using your domain name. No manual keys. No central servers. Just cryptographic certainty.

                                      WKD makes encrypted email as simple as HTTPS made web browsing secure.

                                      https://www.nicfab.eu/en/posts/wkd2/

                                      #WebKeyDirectory #WKD #EmailEncryption #Privacy #InfoSec #Cryptography #OpenPGP

                                      Jeff Mossundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                      Jeff Mossundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                      Jeff Moss
                                      scritto ultima modifica di
                                      #18

                                      @nicfab @yawnbox An article about email security, but no mention of S/MIME?

                                      Nicola Fabianoundefined 1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                                      • Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)undefined Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)

                                        @nicfab I appreciate every attempt to make the web more secure by default.

                                        What is your opinion on if I would state: Isn’t encrypted mail also stored forever and readable in the future? As e-mail lacks PFS…

                                        I’m more concerned about that and things like headers being not encrypted and therefore, leaking meta data, than getting my keys to ppl.

                                        If things must change it is probably SMTP that needs a successor with things like double ratchet session keys and key exchange parameters. And while we’re on it, probably some post quantum ability would fit the timeline we are in.

                                        What do you think?

                                        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                        Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                        Nicola Fabiano
                                        scritto ultima modifica di
                                        #19

                                        @lennybacon 1/6
                                        Your analysis hits the nail on the head. The fundamental architecture of email predates modern cryptography, and what we do today is essentially retrofitting security onto a protocol from the 1970s.

                                        1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
                                        • Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)undefined Daniel Fisher(lennybacon)

                                          @nicfab I appreciate every attempt to make the web more secure by default.

                                          What is your opinion on if I would state: Isn’t encrypted mail also stored forever and readable in the future? As e-mail lacks PFS…

                                          I’m more concerned about that and things like headers being not encrypted and therefore, leaking meta data, than getting my keys to ppl.

                                          If things must change it is probably SMTP that needs a successor with things like double ratchet session keys and key exchange parameters. And while we’re on it, probably some post quantum ability would fit the timeline we are in.

                                          What do you think?

                                          Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                          Nicola Fabianoundefined Questo utente è esterno a questo forum
                                          Nicola Fabiano
                                          scritto ultima modifica di
                                          #20

                                          @lennybacon 2/6
                                          The lack of PFS is indeed critical: every encrypted email becomes a time capsule waiting for quantum computers or a key compromise. Unlike Signal or Matrix, which utilize double-ratchet algorithms to ensure both forward and backward secrecy, email encryption remains static — a single key leak compromises entire email histories.

                                          1 Risposta Ultima Risposta
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                                          🔐 Every unencrypted email is readable by 10+ entities and stored forever.

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