@lxo @oblomov @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
You sound like a Google developer.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
oh yeah
as i explain to you open source, and you push back as if it's a hierarchy with obligations, that means *i* am the corporate goon here
that makes perfect sense
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
oh yeah
as i explain to you open source, and you push back as if it's a hierarchy with obligations, that means *i* am the corporate goon here
that makes perfect sense
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
“Google Chrome is open source”
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nobody cares
that's exactly the problem. users should be aware of the risks, and care about them, checking the developer's power over them.we do whatever the fuck we want. we answer to no one
that's exactly the unchecked power I'm speaking of.and yet you act like there is some sort of structure, obligations, checks and balances
with great power, comes great responsibility
if you extend your implementation recklessly, you undermine the very network you depend on to exist.
it kills the goose that lays golden eggs.
but if the developers don't see that, users who care about the network could and should help them see it.this is anarchy. this is open source. no one owes you anything
this is true
that's why my argument is based on alignment of self interests
users want a working, interoperable network
mastodon wants users for influence and funding
mastodon has power over users because code is law, and most users don't control their servers
users check that power by making it clear that they care about the diverse network with interop
nobody owes you anything, but if they want something from you collectively, you collectively have some leverage
don't waste it, but use it intelligently, is what I'm asking, so that we have a healthier network even if mastodon developers don't care about the goose's health
this is community power dynamics with intelligent checks and balances in collective pursuit of self interests
CC: @oblomov@sociale.network @Jirikiha@raphus.social @macacator@mastodon.social @MyWoolyMastadon@toot.community @john@vyrse.social @engel@mastodon.social @everton137@vivaldi.net@lxo @oblomov @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
there's no power!
open source
anarchy
people build whatever
people use whatever
whatever happens, happens
no chain of command, no network of obligations
and you continue to insist you have a position to stand on that says "somebody owes me"
they don't owe you shit. no one owes me shit. no one owes anyone shit
no one can tell you what to do. no one can tell me what to do
please understand where you are
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undefined oblomov@sociale.network shared this topic
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
“Google Chrome is open source”
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
ok i want you to imagine that i'm not ben royce. i'm elon musk in a rubber mask
whatever you need to tell yourself because i present to you the horrible idea that causes pain in your mind that there are no system of obligations in open source
whatever you need to tell yourself about my malicious demonic intentions
it's a farce
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
ok i want you to imagine that i'm not ben royce. i'm elon musk in a rubber mask
whatever you need to tell yourself because i present to you the horrible idea that causes pain in your mind that there are no system of obligations in open source
whatever you need to tell yourself about my malicious demonic intentions
it's a farce
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
I don't give a rat's ass about who you are. I'm just pointing out what your argument implies. If you don't like it, that's your problem, not mine.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
I don't give a rat's ass about who you are. I'm just pointing out what your argument implies. If you don't like it, that's your problem, not mine.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
right
i understand
when i try to explaint o your there are no obligations in open source that obviously means i am a corporate goon
you got it! 👍
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
right
i understand
when i try to explaint o your there are no obligations in open source that obviously means i am a corporate goon
you got it! 👍
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
again, if you don't like the ethical implication of your position, that's your problem, not mine.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
again, if you don't like the ethical implication of your position, that's your problem, not mine.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
you don't have a problem with me oblomov
you have a problem with reality
you reject reality, not me
you're shooting the messenger
if it makes you feel better, shoot away, i don't care
reality doesn't change though
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@lxo @oblomov @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
there's no power!
open source
anarchy
people build whatever
people use whatever
whatever happens, happens
no chain of command, no network of obligations
and you continue to insist you have a position to stand on that says "somebody owes me"
they don't owe you shit. no one owes me shit. no one owes anyone shit
no one can tell you what to do. no one can tell me what to do
please understand where you are
dude, wake up
nobody owes you or me
but they have interests in us
so we have leverage
it's stupid to not use it to keep this network that we like healthier, if the developers don't care about the network, but care about getting users
please understand where you are, as you say
or remain stubborn and miss opportunities to actually defend what you evidently enjoy
CC: @oblomov@sociale.network @Jirikiha@raphus.social @macacator@mastodon.social @MyWoolyMastadon@toot.community @john@vyrse.social @engel@mastodon.social @everton137@vivaldi.net
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
you don't have a problem with me oblomov
you have a problem with reality
you reject reality, not me
you're shooting the messenger
if it makes you feel better, shoot away, i don't care
reality doesn't change though
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
I strive for a better world rather than reveling in its shit.
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dude, wake up
nobody owes you or me
but they have interests in us
so we have leverage
it's stupid to not use it to keep this network that we like healthier, if the developers don't care about the network, but care about getting users
please understand where you are, as you say
or remain stubborn and miss opportunities to actually defend what you evidently enjoy
CC: @oblomov@sociale.network @Jirikiha@raphus.social @macacator@mastodon.social @MyWoolyMastadon@toot.community @john@vyrse.social @engel@mastodon.social @everton137@vivaldi.net@lxo @oblomov @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
alexandre:
enjoy advocating for interop with a dead protocol
killed by tech improvement for better features
no sorry, killed just because mastodon is unrelenting evil
go for it
you have massive leverage, and a completely airtight rationale for doing so
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@lxo @oblomov @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
alexandre:
enjoy advocating for interop with a dead protocol
killed by tech improvement for better features
no sorry, killed just because mastodon is unrelenting evil
go for it
you have massive leverage, and a completely airtight rationale for doing so
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
I like how you completely missed the point and keep focusing on the ostatus thing because that's really the only thing you can do in this discussion.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
I strive for a better world rather than reveling in its shit.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
well articulate a coherent means to do so, rather than just gnashing your teeth in frustration that it is shit
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
well articulate a coherent means to do so, rather than just gnashing your teeth in frustration that it is shit
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
it has been done, and you keep focusing on that, so that's enough time wasted on that.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
it has been done, and you keep focusing on that, so that's enough time wasted on that.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
oblomov, this entire thread is a farce
i'm arguing with two people who think they have leverage they do not. for purposes that can only be fulfilled in a hierarchy that does not exist
and for pointing out the obvious, i'm apparently a google goon and a libertarian moron
🤣
pure farce
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
oblomov, this entire thread is a farce
i'm arguing with two people who think they have leverage they do not. for purposes that can only be fulfilled in a hierarchy that does not exist
and for pointing out the obvious, i'm apparently a google goon and a libertarian moron
🤣
pure farce
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
on the contrary, it has been very illuminating on your preference to accept and defend abusive and toxic behavior. It's not every day that I get to add a note to a user profile.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
on the contrary, it has been very illuminating on your preference to accept and defend abusive and toxic behavior. It's not every day that I get to add a note to a user profile.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
this is like saying "you defend drunk driving merely because you accept drunk drivers exist"
i accept the reality in a flat nonhierarchy that mastodon can do whatever it wants, therefore i am defending everything mastodon does?
🤣
think whatever you want oblomov. if you need to smear me with intentions i don't have and statements i never made, go for it
we all need to cope
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
this is like saying "you defend drunk driving merely because you accept drunk drivers exist"
i accept the reality in a flat nonhierarchy that mastodon can do whatever it wants, therefore i am defending everything mastodon does?
🤣
think whatever you want oblomov. if you need to smear me with intentions i don't have and statements i never made, go for it
we all need to cope
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
When people point out that drunk driving leads to loss of life, there's two ways to respond:
«true, and that's bad, mayb we should do something to minimize drunk driving and its negative effect» is one
«that's life, there's nothing you can do to eliminate drunk driving so better live with it» is the other
You chose one, we chose the other. That tells more about us than it does about drunk driving indeed.
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@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
When people point out that drunk driving leads to loss of life, there's two ways to respond:
«true, and that's bad, mayb we should do something to minimize drunk driving and its negative effect» is one
«that's life, there's nothing you can do to eliminate drunk driving so better live with it» is the other
You chose one, we chose the other. That tells more about us than it does about drunk driving indeed.
@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
more like i'm arguing with
"we stop drunk drivers by demanding they stop drinking, that will work. i have magical leverage over their behavior"
and now you understand the real contrast in arguments here
of course the real world solution to drunk drivers is punishment. in a system
and there's no system here
and now i get called immoral for pointing out reality
shoot that messenger oblomov! shoot him!
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@oblomov @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
more like i'm arguing with
"we stop drunk drivers by demanding they stop drinking, that will work. i have magical leverage over their behavior"
and now you understand the real contrast in arguments here
of course the real world solution to drunk drivers is punishment. in a system
and there's no system here
and now i get called immoral for pointing out reality
shoot that messenger oblomov! shoot him!
@benroyce @lxo @Jirikiha @macacator @MyWoolyMastadon @john @engel @everton137
thanks for confirming you're saying what I said you were saying, and that you didn't understand our argument.
BTW, «there's nothing we can do to change things, so we should stop thinking about how to change things» is bullshit. It's an excuse, and an exigology
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PeerTube: https://github.com/YunoHost-Apps/peertube_ynh/issues
Pixelfed: https://github.com/YunoHost-Apps/pixelfed_ynh/issues
I will wait another week for #PeerTube since my channel is so essential, running the Fediverse promo video and all...
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Usato di sicura valutazione.
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