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Piero Bosio Social Web Site Personale Logo Fediverso

Social Forum federato con il resto del mondo. Non contano le istanze, contano le persone

Ich will deswegen nicht gleich auf Github eine Issue eröffnen.

General Discussion
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Gli ultimi otto messaggi ricevuti dalla Federazione
  • @mariusor @steve I can see this happening. I originally wrote GnuCrusty in 2003 and now I'd like to expand my community's reach by retro-fitting AP support. GnuCrusty users can write Manifestos, and other uses can reply with Grievances, so those are a great match to AP Article and Note respectively. But I have a Manifestos table and a Grievances table. There's no equivalent to AP Image, so if a C2S user posts one of those, what am I supposed to do? The least worst answer is, munge it into the Manifestos table (after a 300 page flame war in 2012 the community decided that art need not be ASCII, so the schema supports images there). So you see exactly the effect you describe.

    I'm just going to tell all my users that if they use a third-party C2S client, they might see unexpected results. Instead I recommend they use the official GnuCrusty client, available for both FreeBSD and Devuan. Not a big problem.

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  • @steve I think I’d be Quite Annoyed if a server did that when the C2S app I’m writing sent a Note. I’m asking it to Create a Note - I expect it to create a Note or fail to create a Note, not do some weird, unexpected third thing.

    I could maybe tolerate it adding a second type, but while my code can handle multiple types most ActivityPub software doesn’t seem to accept that kind of thing.

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  • @jerger @steve

    Keeping msgs immutable is a general best-practice, I gather.

    In the case you mention it becomes confusing to still use client/server terminology. You have a full actor on the client's side, and when it sends a msg it acts in server/S2S role.

    Btw, in that scenario we do not have to make the distinction client + server anymore, as we have just actors communicating with each other. Then we can think in terms of the actor model, and honor its qualities.

    A client sending to the server's outbox is then analogous to an actor sending to another actor's inbox. That is a one-way msg exchange usually, fire and forget (esp. in a pure event-driven architecture... which the current fediverse is not). The remote actor is not responsible for keeping the Activity (event) in its server-outbox / actor.inbox. That corresponds to the spec part "may disappear at any moment".

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  • @steve If you consider also peer 2 peer networking as an option, your client might switch it's role and act as a server.

    In this case it having such a different inside outside mapping for objects will become confusing.

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  • @mariusor Yes, I'm seeing it in a real server while doing C2S testing/exploration. In this case, the server can handle Note and Article, in general, so I don't the rationale yet for the conversion. It's in pre-release code so it may or may not be intentional.

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  • @steve

    lets say there is a local-server sending this create/note to a distant-server.

    Whatever object distant-server creates internally I am very neutral.

    But I am very engaged from

    1. viewpoint of local-server I expect to get feedback about a note object & being able to deref a note object.
    2. viewpoint of distant-server user I expect to see a object behaving like a note.

    In a bottom line - naming a note different makes absolutely no sense at all ...

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  • @steve but did you actually observe this behaviour in any servers? What made you ask the question?

    To me it sounds very implausible, because the server *actively* needs to do something instead of piping the received activity directly to its recipients. Is it a case of "the server doesn't render Note objects" so they silently convert to something they do?

    Even that's implausible to me, because the same code can be used to render both...

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  • @mariusor Like you said, I'm not sure the user (rather than the client dev) cares about details like the AP object type. However, they may care from a UX perspective if their messages are silently dropped (during S2S federation because the type was changed). And if they do care, they'll probably complain to the client developer who didn't cause the problem. 😉

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Post suggeriti
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    I have to properly do it in wafrn, but its a good idea tbh. Its GTS interaction policies, more software should implement it! Me included
  • 1 Votes
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    I've got little left with #ehLabs after implementing replies and quote posts. Meta #Threads needs to catch up in their #ActivityPub implementation. My hope with ehLabs is to provide a decent quality feed algorithm and content addressability through IPFS. Images provided for testing purposes.
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    Now witness the power of this fully operational Fediverse!https://shkspr.mobi/blog/2025/11/now-witness-the-power-of-this-fully-operational-fediverse/How can you measure the popularity of a social network site? Perhaps by counting the number of active accounts, or the quality of the discourse, or even how many people reply to your witty memes.Me? I prefer to look at how many people visit my blog from each site. It is an imperfect measure - and a vain one - but lets me know where I should be spending my time. No point posting on a network which is just bots talking to each other, right?Earlier this year I built a stats-counter for my blog. Every time someone clicks from a website which links to my blog, it records that visit in a database. I get to see which blog posts are doing numbers, and where those numbers came from.Until fairly recently, the Mastodon social network didn't send referer details. I thought that reduced the visibility of the network and lobbied for it to change. As various Mastodon servers upgrade, and admins opt-in, it is becoming more apparent just how much traffic originates from the Fediverse.Over the last few weeks, here's how many people have clicked from BlueSky and Mastodon to one of my blog posts.TotalSource1,607bsky.app752mastodon.socialAt first glance, it doesn't look good for our elephantine friends, does it? The butterfly sends over twice the traffic. Game over!But, of course, while Mastodon.social is the biggest instance - it is far from the only one. What happens if we slide down the long tail? Here's all the Mastodon-ish instances which sent me over 10 clicks.TotalSource193phanpy.social120 android-app://org.joinmastodon.android/106infosec.exchange62mas.to59mstdn.social55social.vivaldi.net49wandering.shop48fosstodon.org33mathstodon.xyz27mastodon.online26mastodon.scot24app.wafrn.net19indieweb.social18social.lol17tech.lgbt17toot.wales16en.osm.town16feditrends.com14mstdn.ca14piefed.social12wetdry.world11c.im11mastodon.nl51 Sites sending < 10 clicksAh! Add them all up and you get a grand total of 1,773 visitors from Mastodon-powered sites. That's more than BlueSky.Now, there are some obvious caveats to the data:I have a smaller follower count on BlueSky than I do on Mastodon.My posts may appeal more to one demographic than another.People may have strict privacy controls which suppress the true volume of visitors.There's no way to measure how long someone spends reading my posts.RSS and newsletter visitors aren't counted.Clicks from apps may not always show a referer.Some people may be on multiple services.Fediverse users can follow the post directly, so don't need to visit the site to read it.And yet… no matter how you slice it, Fediverse servers are sending as much traffic as BlueSky!I think this is brilliant. Web services should be able to scale from small to big - and each ActivityPub-powered site helps power the open Internet.Just for completeness, this is how Reddit, Facebook, LinkedIn, Twitter, and Lemmy do over the same period:TotalSource1,158reddit.com585 android-app://com.reddit.frontpage/76facebook.com76https://old.reddit.com/r/programming/56https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/52youtube.com41t.co38https://old.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/1nsw7f4/til_in_mongolia_instead_of_a_street_address_a/31linkedin.com27 android-app://io.syncapps.lemmy_sync/27https://www.reddit.com/r/todayilearned/comments/1nsw7f4/til_in_mongolia_instead_of_a_street_address_a/22https://old.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/1n96ftn/40_years_later_are_bentleys_programming_pearls/22lemmy.ca17 android-app://com.linkedin.android/16lemmy.dbzer0.com14feddit.org11https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/1n96ftn/40_years_later_are_bentleys_programming_pearls/10discuss.tchncs.de10l.instagram.com8lemmy.blahaj.zone6https://www.reddit.com/r/GrapheneOS/comments/1m2l84b/considering_making_the_switch_does_google_pay/6reddthat.comIf you add up all the Lemmy instances, they send about as much traffic as Facebook and LinkedIn combined. That's not a huge surprise - those platforms hate anyone clicking away to the wider web.Twitter is basically the Dead Internet. I'm no longer on there, but I do occasionally search it to see who is sharing my posts. The popular posts I write get shared a lot - sometimes by accounts with huge followers - yet there are no comments or retweets and barely and clicks.I don't do Instagram or Threads, and that might be reflected in their low numbers. But I'm not active on YouTube either - yet people there occasionally link back to me.Final ThoughtsFirstly, my stats only represent my site. Your site might be very different.Secondly, I've ignored search engine traffic, big blogs, newsletters, and other sources.Thirdly, and most importantly, this isn't a competition! The desire for a "winner-takes-all" service is dangerous and disturbing. An ecosystem is at its most vibrant when there are multiple participants each thriving in their own niche.I want a thousand sites, running a hundred different software stacks, some of which only serve a dozen people, or even a lone participant.Diversity is strength.#activitypub #bluesky #fediverse #mastodon #statistics
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    Vacations are wonderful. It is a privilege to be able to travel without worry. It's also wonderful to be home, and to have the time to work on projects I care about. With those thoughts in mind, I present release v3.1.1 of Ktistec, an ActivityPub server written in the Crystal programming language!This release is a mixed bag of small features and improvements:AddedAuto-link URLs in posts. (fixes #24)Support searching by actor username. (fixes #102)Support hourly granularity in metrics charts.FixedMark actor as down if refresh fails.Remove draft posts from the everything collection.Ignore charts with no points in the date range.Ensure HTTP::Client instances are closed.I added support for multiple users at the beginning of the month. I'm very interested in feedback on how that's working out for anyone using it.#ktistec #fediverse #activitypub #crystallang